Sunday with Niall Paterson Interview with Victoria Atkins MP Crime Minister

ANY QUOTES USED MUST BE ATTRIBUTED TO SUNDAY WITH NIALL PATERSON, SKY NEWS

NIALL PATERSON: Let’s turn to our main story this morning of course, the surge of knife crime in London and we’re joined by the Crime Minister, Victoria Atkins, a very good morning to you. Let’s just dwell on the numbers here: 51 fatalities in London this year as a result of deliberate killings, 44 deaths in the first three months of 2018, the comparison with New York has been made by many people. What’s going wrong?

VICTORIA ATKINS: Well first of all our thoughts must be with the families of those affected because it is the most horrendous crime, it is certainly beyond my imagination and we’re doing everything we can both to help the families but also to stop this violence and so today we’re announcing the launch of the Offensive Weapons Bill which is a Bill which we’ve asked the police, the CPS and others for what they think, what extra powers they need to try and stop the scourge of this violence and tomorrow the Home Secretary is announcing our Serious Violence Strategy which is an all-encompassing strategy to deal with serious violence and to stop kids in particular from picking up knives and acid in the first place.

NP: But my question was, what’s going wrong here? It is fair to say over the past decade we have seen crime coming down but certain forms of violent crime, I mean it’s ridiculous. In the year ending – even if we don’t look at this year’s statistics – the year ending September 2017 in England and Wales, knife crime up by 21%, gun crime up by 20%, possession of an article with a blade or a point up by 35%. I mean this is happening on your watch, you must shoulder some of the responsibility.

VICTORIA ATKINS: Well we know that some of the increase in reporting is down to better recording by the police …

NP: But you’re not suggesting there hasn’t been a spike in violence?

VICTORIA ATKINS: Absolutely not, I’m not suggesting that for a moment and we know that there has been genuine rises in some of these crimes and there are a whole host of factors. We’ve heard from the Met Commissioner about the impact of social media with some of these videos that wind gangs up to retaliate very quickly; we know that we want to stop the assumption amongst some young people that it’s normal to carry a knife which is why we’ve had the knife free campaign which Sky very kindly featured a couple of weeks ago, there are all sorts of factors and indeed the Serious Violence strategy tomorrow will show the impact of drugs on violence as well, we know that’s having a huge impact. So we’ve got to have an all-encompassing solution to this.

NP: It’s strange that you don’t mention for example policing numbers. I mean front line roles down by 14% between 2010 and 2017, you’re telling me that there is absolutely no correlation between that and the increase in serious violence?

VICTORIA ATKINS: We have to look at the evidence and a great deal of thought has gone into this and we review it constantly be we know that in 2008 when there was a spike, a similar spike in knife crime, there were many, many more officers on the beat then than there are now so it is not as simple as just putting, just talking about police numbers but of course …

NP: So why has Cressida Dick put 300 extra officers on the streets then?

VICTORIA ATKINS: Of course it’s down to Chief Constables and to Police and Crime Commissioners and the Mayor of London to decide what’s best on the streets of their locality to tackle this and I fully support the Commissioner in taking that decision if that’s her assessment on the evidence, looking at how it’s panning out across London, of course she’s got to do that.

NP: Again Sadiq Khan offering £15 million extra funding to try and tackle violent crime, you have to concede that over the time that the Conservatives have been in power we have seen a significant reduction in police numbers, we have seen a significant reduction in the amount that has been spent on policing – I think the Met has to find an additional £400, 500 million of savings by 2021/22, that has to have had an affect somewhere.

VICTORIA ATKINS: We’ve looked at the evidence very carefully and we know that with police officer numbers and with funding over the last several years that knife crime has fluctuated in that so whilst I don’t for a moment ignore the point of police officers on the streets and so on, it’s not the only answer and this is why with the Offensive Weapons Bill we are giving the police the powers they need – and also that charities, people that work with young people, tell us that there are areas that we need to improve on in terms of making sure the police have the powers but also that …

NP: But key amongst that must surely be funding, I mean social care funding has gone for that, it’s gone for youth workers incentives, it’s gone for that, the EMA, that’s gone, general austerity – I mean clearly there is not as much money in the pot as there once was but surely we should be prioritising the spending in places, for example in youth services, surely we should be prioritising spending there ahead of other things.

VICTORIA ATKINS: Well that’s a matter for local councils but we …

NP: But they don’t have the money to do it anymore.

VICTORIA ATKINS: … as government we invested £920 million in the Troubled Families Programme, about a month ago I launched the Trusted Relationships Fund which targets those children, those young people who are most at risk of being exploited, who have been let down by every adult in their life and there are also other measures, for example the Knife Crime Community Fund, we had the first tranche of that in the autumn whereby we’ve asked small local charities to put their bids in and we’ve handed out £765,000 to help them deal with their work very locally in their local communities and we’re announcing the second tranche of that in the spring and another up to a million pounds to help them. So there are many ways of tackling this and we’ve got to give local Chief Constables and local Police and Crime Commissioners the flexibility to deal with issues as they see fit. What might work in one part of the country won’t necessarily work elsewhere.

NP: Okay, you are talking about giving more freedom to Police and Crime Commissioners, you also talked about the role that social media companies have to play, you’ve also talked about the role that drugs clearly have in all of this. At the same time the Conservatives have been in power since 2010 and I go back to those statistics – knife crime up by 21%, gun crime up by 20%, possession of an article with a blade up 35%, 35,000 offences in the year ending March 2017 involving a knife. It is your responsibility, ultimately it is your fault.

VICTORIA ATKINS: Well overall crime has of course decreased over that period of time but I challenge with you saying it is our fault, the responsibility …

NP: The fault’s not Labour’s is it?

VICTORIA ATKINS: No, no, no, but the responsibility, what we are saying in the Knife Free campaign and all our work when we are funding young people’s advocates in major cities across the country, we’re working with charities such as Red Thread which intervene in A&E departments so they get that child, that young person, at the teachable moment but we want to make it clear that we have to, as a society, take responsibility for this, that we want to stop these young people from making that terrible decision to pick up a knife in the first place because if they pick that knife up it can have terrible consequences for other people but of course themselves as well if they do very bad harm with it.

NP: Victoria Atkins, many thanks for joining us.

VICTORIA ATKINS: Thank you.