Murnaghan Interview with Damian Hinds MP, Conservative, 30.10.16

ANY QUOTES USED MUST BE ATTRIBUTED TO MURNAGHAN, SKY NEWS

DERMOT MURNAGHAN: The government is planning reforms to the way disabled people claim their benefits in a drive to get more people back in to work. This consultation will be announced tomorrow proposing a more, and I quote, targeted and personalised way to help people find jobs. Labour has accused the government of tinkering around the edges. Well I am joined now by Damian Hinds, the Employment Minister.  A very good morning to you, Mr Hinds. This could be interpreted as tinkering, targeting, how many people will it affect?

DAMIAN HINDS: Well in the what’s called the support group within Employment Support, it’s about a million and a half people, and these are people who are furthest away from being in work but many of them could be in work and many of them want to be in work but because of being in the support group, which does carry a higher rate of benefit, as you get lower support through the Job Centre network and so on and we’re looking at how you can tailor that, treating everyone as an individual [inaudible] works best.  

DM: But did you set up a support group that doesn’t offer support?  They got that wrong didn’t they?

DAMIAN HINDS: Well it’s quite right that for people who can’t work of course there should be ongoing support but what we are looking at now is asking disabled people themselves, asking the charities who work with disabled people, the experts in the field, how we can do better to make sure that we have more support and appropriate support to help people to overcome whatever barriers there may be and sometimes they are quite high, sometimes it takes quite a lot of time and actually it needs more support to help them to get back towards employment.  

DM: Well there you are, you’ve said it, we could do better and you’re saying it is affecting hundreds and thousands, maybe over a million people, a repudiation of the policies of the past from your own party, you were too harsh on these people.

DAMIAN HINDS: Well I think it is right that there is a work capability assessment, that actually came in under the Labour government in 2008 and we’ve …

DM: Damian Green, the Work and Pensions Secretary, talked about the work capability assessment saying some people don’t have to go through them all again so George Osborne, Iain Duncan Smith when he was in post, they were too harsh.

DAMIAN HINDS: Well the work capability assessment has been reviewed five times and a number of improvements have been made, there’s much better understanding about mental health conditions, about the specific impediments to work or how particular conditions affect your ability to work.  What we’re talking about today in the Green Paper that comes out tomorrow, the consultation is asking how we can do better with that work capability assessment to assess what sorts of support would be most appropriate for people without jeopardising a higher level of benefit that they are in receipt of.

DM: Is there a cost to this though, this potential softening?

DAMIAN HINDS: Well first of all I must stress we’re not looking through this, it is not about welfare savings, it’s about better tailored support and there a lot of people who are …

DM: But you are still within the same budget, you’ve still got those Osborne cuts coming down the line until we hear the autumn statement or indeed the first Philip Hammond budget but at the moment there is still substantial, billions of pounds  of cuts in the pipeline for years to come.  Are those things that will be re-examined overall because that’s what the charities, that’s what the Labour party is saying you should really be looking at?

DAMIAN HINDS: Well we’re asking charities, we’re asking disabled people how we can do better with this assessment of tailored support.  Look, we have a network of over 700 Job Centres around the country, we work with many third sector organisations, individual organisations locally, some on a national basis, all of them doing something to help people get closer back to work …

DM: But are you prepared to spend more money on that ambition?

DAMIAN HINDS: … and we are currently recruiting, we are increasing the number of staff right now who are work coaches in our Job Centres and part of the question is how do we deploy our resource to best use so the people that need the most support get the most support.

DM: I still don’t think you answered the simple question: is it still within that same envelope of spending?  It seems like we have got a whole new administration, we have certainly got a new Chancellors, we’ve got new personnel in at the Department of Work and Pensions, is it within that same overall budget or are you prepared to loosen the ties a bit?

DAMIAN HINDS: Well Dermot, you will know that the Chancellor has an autumn statement coming up and it is for the Chancellor to say exactly what is in his plans but what we are talking about today is how we take the support that is available through the Job Centre network and possibly through  other channels as well and how we deploy that more effectively.  We have a lot more people getting into work,  there are fewer unemployed people now, down below 5% unemployment but there are still a lot of people who are not in the labour market who would like to work and our question is how do we do better, how can we do better to help them to fulfil all their potential.

DM: Well let’s talk about people in work and I want to ask you about the Nissan deal or not, did the government do a deal with Nissan to keep its investment in the Sunderland plant?  Greg Clark the Business Secretary said this morning that the UK objective is to have no tariffs or bureaucratic barriers to the UK auto sector selling into the EU market.

DAMIAN HINDS: Well look, this is fantastic news so Nissan confirming about the Qashqai and also the Xtrail, it secures 7000 jobs in the north-east and a further 28,000 in the UK supply chain, this is a good news story and we should celebrate it for what it is.  It’s a great vote of confidence in Great Britain, it’s a great vote of confidence in the north-east and it is also I think a vote of confidence in the ongoing and long standing support and partnership that the UK government has had with the automotive sector on things like skills, on investing in infrastructure, on our commitment to development of low carbon technologies and so on.

DM: Will other car makers get similar guarantees?

DAMIAN HINDS: There is nothing that has been promised to Nissan which is not available to other car makers, this is about the conditions …

DM: Well what has been promised to Nissan?

DAMIAN HINDS: This is about the conditions that are in this country which are advantageous for car manufacturers so for example we have already, the government has invested £400 million since 2010 in the automotive sector, we’ve got the advanced propulsion centre and investing in low carbon technologies.

DM: So nothing has been offered to Nissan that will not be offered to other car makers, so what has been offered to Nissan?

DAMIAN HINDS: That is not available to other car makers, so this is about a highly skilled workforce, it’s about the government taking the big decisions to make the right investments in our infrastructure, big bold decisions, it’s about our commitment to three million apprenticeships starting by 2020 …

DM: And if the UK does a so-called hard Brexit and has to operate under World Trade Organisation rules and you face up to 10% tariffs on your exports, you’ll be compensated?

DAMIAN HINDS: There has been no promise of money made to Nissan and I think … I don’t accept this choice from hard Brexit, soft Brexit, is it the single market, is it immigration.  The Prime Minister has been very clear that the government seeks to maximise the opportunities for British companies to trade with and in the European market and also for companies from those countries to trade with and in our market and also to get control of immigration.  The point for the automotive sector is that the government is reaffirming its commitment to the automotive sector, is reaffirming all the things we want to develop as a trading nation, being outward looking, being bold, being ambitious and carrying on the great record that the car industry in this country has exporting a million cars last year.

DM: So much going on your patch Mr Hinds, I want to ask you about this Über decision at an employment tribunal to members of the Über community, as they call it, who said we are employees and the employment tribunal decided yes, they were.  Would you legislate in some way, shape or form to make sure that people in this so-called gig economy do have the rights to be employees if they want?

DAMIAN HINDS: Well I understand Über may appeal that decision and in any case it wouldn’t be right for me to talk about an individual company, an individual case but it is true that there has been a growth in this so called gig economy or platform economy or on demand work and that’s part of a wider growth in self-employment.  The Prime Minister, in recognition of some of these changes in the nature of work and some of the concerns that people have, has appointed Matthew Taylor to lead a review into all these aspects, things like security at work, making sure people are being paid fairly, about representation, about progression in work and about making sure that under-represented groups in the workforce can maximise their share of opportunities in this new part of the economy.

DM: So you are looking into it.  Damian Hinds, we’ve got to end it there, thank you very much Minister, very good to see you.  The Employment Minister there.